Scene Safe vs Param Safe

M32 and X32 Digital Consoles
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donahooc1969
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Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2022 3:48 pm

Scene Safe vs Param Safe

Post by donahooc1969 »

According to the documentation the Param Safe should prevent saving sections of a scene and the scene safe prevents recall of a specific section. I have 3 Midas M32s as well as some proTools machines and route audio between them. I have scenes that are identical except the routing. Some use Dante, Some ARS and a combination of local inputs. I use Param Safes on the user routing because they constantly get accidentally overwritten (3 audio techs). The problem is that the Param Safe blocks saving routing but also recalling routing which is what the scene safe should do. I put a ticket in with Music tribe and they told me Param Safes block recall and nothing blocks saving which is opposite of the documentation. Anyone experienced this? Basically the Param Safe disables all routing saving and recall and makes everything manual. My only work around it write protected scene files on a USB which is a pain when I need to make changes. Thanks
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pvannatto
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Re: Scene Safe vs Param Safe

Post by pvannatto »

Hi @donahooc1969, welcome to the forum. I'm not sure which documentation you are referring to. But safes always restrict setting changes on recall only. They have no effect in the saving of the scene. We have known that for over 10 years. Unfortunately safes have been poorly documented (IMO) and I rarely use them because of that. Instead it would be better to use snippets to make specific changes (eg routing) after the scene is loaded. Cues can be used to combine scenes and snippets.

Snippets can be created by either using the Snippet screen, use a text editor to make a snippet file, or use X32 Scene Parser to make a snippet file from a known good scene file.
Paul Vannatto
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craigf
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Re: Scene Safe vs Param Safe

Post by craigf »

As Paul said, back in the day the documentation was all over the place. There was a lot of confusion (mostly to do with language differences) between "save" and "safe." What was determined was that when a scene was saved (almost) the whole console's configuration was saved; every fader level, every eq setting, every routing option, regardless of whatever "safes" were turned on or off. The safes only affect the recall. If something is safed, then recalling a new scene won't change the mixer's current setting of whatever is safed. eg if your console's current routing has localpreamps>inputs, the new scene to be recalled has card>inputs, but the RoutingIO is "safed," when that new scene is recalled the console's routing won't change; it'll still be on localpreamps>inputs.

As for scene safes vs param safe; they're both to do with recall, but parameter safes are a bit more granular (though IMO not granular enough.)

As Paul suggested, it's probably better to use snippets where possible. Where a scene saves the console's (almost) whole configuration (and coiuld therefore change a whole lot of stuff when recalled if the safes are not set up correctly,) a snippet can be set up to only save a very small setting (eg just a single channel's eq's 2nd band's Q value.) If you set up snippets for your different routing configurations, then the only data in the snippet will be to do with routing. When that snippet gets recalled, only the console's routing will change, not the gains, not the fader levels, not the FX etc, regardless of what is or isn't safed.
donahooc1969
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Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2022 3:48 pm

Re: Scene Safe vs Param Safe

Post by donahooc1969 »

pvannatto wrote: Tue Jun 28, 2022 4:47 pm Hi @donahooc1969, welcome to the forum. I'm not sure which documentation you are referring to. But safes always restrict setting changes on recall only. They have no effect in the saving of the scene. We have known that for over 10 years. Unfortunately safes have been poorly documented (IMO) and I rarely use them because of that. Instead it would be better to use snippets to make specific changes (eg routing) after the scene is loaded. Cues can be used to combine scenes and snippets.

Snippets can be created by either using the Snippet screen, use a text editor to make a snippet file, or use X32 Scene Parser to make a snippet file from a known good scene file.
It was in the Midas M32 documentation. They contacted me and confirmed that their manual was incorrect and said they are fixing it. It would be better if the board actually worked like the manual and prevented saving routing info. If it will let you save the config but never recall it then the config is worthless. I'm moving all my configs to a write protected USB.
donahooc1969
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Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2022 3:48 pm

Re: Scene Safe vs Param Safe

Post by donahooc1969 »

Thanks for the help guys. I'm keeping my configs on a write protected USB and using snippets for the routing changes that need to be easily recalled. Once again, the forum is much more helpful than tech support.
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