How to route Monitor Send?

The new Flow8 digital console
hionhifi
Posts: 6
Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2022 1:13 am

How to route Monitor Send?

Post by hionhifi »

Hello, I am new to mixing and I am trying to figure out how to feed processed audio to my video camera from the FLOW 8?

Scenario:
I want to be able to use my XLR microphone for Skype, Zoom, video conferencing and video recording. I want to use the processing capability of the FLOW 8 to shape the audio before going into the camera so that it's baked into the camera audio and recorded along side the video feed.

I know I could do this on the Main output, but I don't want to process ALL the audio coming out of the FLOW 8. I believe the FX1 is the way I need to route it but I'm not sure. Also, I'm not sure how to do it.

What I've tried:
On my Yamaha AG06 mixer I connected the stereo output to the cameras headphone/mic combo input using a 3.5mm TRS to Dual 1/4" TS Pro Stereo Breakout Cable.

Image

I connected the Monitor Send to the camera with a 3.5mm TRS to Dual 1/4" TS Pro Stereo Breakout Cable but that didn't work. Plus I don't think I would have gotten the audio processed that way. I'm not sure how to proceed.

Image

Here are the components
  • FLOW 8
  • Dynamic XLR microphone
  • MacBook Pro
  • Video camera (3.5mm input)
Here is a pic of my FLOW 8 Dashboard.

Image

Can any of the pro's help here?

Thomas
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kgallen
Posts: 71
Joined: Sat May 07, 2022 5:44 pm
Location: Gloucestershire, UK

Re: How to route Monitor Send?

Post by kgallen »

You’re nearly there. Use the same cable in the Flow8 MON outputs.

In the app you need to go into Setup (the gear wheel icon) and in Routing you need to click a couple of things:
- check STEREO MON 1/2
- Monitor1,2 POST
- check the boxes for FX1 into MON1,MON2
(Note you’ll need the latest app version and latest firmware on your Flow8).

Back in the main part of the app:
- on the MON1 screen raise the fader for your mic channel (this is the ‘dry’)
- on the FX1 screen also raise the fader for the mic channel (this is the ‘wet’)

The relative positions of the MON and FX1 faders determine the wet/dry ratio to control how much FX1 you want in your MON mix

Hope that’s enough info for you to fathom it out!
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hionhifi
Posts: 6
Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2022 1:13 am

Re: How to route Monitor Send?

Post by hionhifi »

kgallen wrote: Wed Jun 01, 2022 7:50 am You’re nearly there. Use the same cable in the Flow8 MON outputs.

In the app you need to go into Setup (the gear wheel icon) and in Routing you need to click a couple of things:
- check STEREO MON 1/2
- Monitor1,2 POST
- check the boxes for FX1 into MON1,MON2
(Note you’ll need the latest app version and latest firmware on your Flow8).

Back in the main part of the app:
- on the MON1 screen raise the fader for your mic channel (this is the ‘dry’)
- on the FX1 screen also raise the fader for the mic channel (this is the ‘wet’)

The relative positions of the MON and FX1 faders determine the wet/dry ratio to control how much FX1 you want in your MON mix

Hope that’s enough info for you to fathom it out!
Thanks kgallen, here's I've come up with. I tried the fix. Not sure I got it right though because I can't hear any processing being done to my voice, ie when I select Cathedral as an FX shouldn't I be able to hear my voice echoing, etc.? I think I may have the MIX wrong. Also, I get no levels on the camera. Here's my setup below. Let me know what you think might be the problem.

ROUTING
Image

PAGE
MAIN
Image
MIC3 @ -25db. I can hear myself through the speakers. Good 2 Go.
USB 1/2 (Computer Audio) @ -25db. I can hear computer audio.Good 2 Go.
MAIN OUT level: 0.0db

MON1
Image
MIC3 @ -25db. I can hear myself through the speakers. Good 2 Go.
USB 1/2 (Computer Audio) @ -25db. I can hear computer audio.Good 2 Go.
MONITOR 1 level: -45db (Nothing I can hear is affected by this level), Do I need to be concerned about it?

FX1
Image
Problem: I can't hear any of the effects on my voice. "This is where I think I have the MIX incorrect."
MIC3 @ -25db. I can hear myself through the speakers. Good 2 Go.
USB 1/2 (Computer Audio) @ -25db. I can hear computer audio. Good 2 Go.
EFFECT 1 level: -09db (Nothing I can hear is affected by this level), Do I need to be concerned about it?

FX
Image

HARDWARE
Image

QUESTIONS:
How do I hear my processed voice, by pressing the FX1 or MON1 button?

Thomas
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kgallen
Posts: 71
Joined: Sat May 07, 2022 5:44 pm
Location: Gloucestershire, UK

Re: How to route Monitor Send?

Post by kgallen »

Hi @hionhifi

I don’t see any obvious issues with your Flow8 setup.

Reading back your original post: did you get this working with your Yamaha mixer - or at least some audio into the camera? I ask because you mention the camera input is a ‘combo Jack headphone/mic’ - this may mean it’s a TRRS or other Jack type which would give us some issues. Can you confirm the correct connection to the camera in this respect?

Also if you have some headphones can you confirm any output from the Flow8? You can use the Routing page to point Phones at the MON1,2 outputs (and select POST) and we can use that as a sure fire check of the Flow8 config, factoring out cable/camera issues.

Also can you see any activity on the Flow8 output meters trying first Main and then MON1?

For confirmation could you also photo the Flow8 connector panel without your iPad in the way.

Thanks,
Kevin

ETA: I just tried this setup on my Flow8, pointed the Phones at MON1,2 and it works as expected.

ETA2: I found these TRRS pinouts: https://stackoverflow.com/questions/382 ... -recording
In both cases the mic input is where the sleeve would be on a TRS jack (the tip and ring being the headphone connections). In both cases this would mean the mic input shorted to ground, hence no input to the camera. If your camera has a stereo mic input, and presumably stereo headphone output, then I've no idea how the connector is configured. Let's first confirm the Flow8 output as above using headphones if possible, then then if that's ok, we're down to the connection to the camera and finding the correct lead to make this connection. Can you tell us the make/model of the camera you're using so we can look up the user manual.
hionhifi
Posts: 6
Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2022 1:13 am

Re: How to route Monitor Send?

Post by hionhifi »

Yes, I’ll check out the things you suggested today after work. In the meantime here’s my android phone model.

LG V10 Model LG-H901.

I have a headphone/mic adapter/splitter cable plugged into the Android phone’s combo jack. I have the aforementioned stereo unbalanced cable connected to the mic input. Nothing connected to the headphone input. In my camera app, the camera does “see” that an external mic is connected. When the adapter/splitter cable is disconnected the external mic input disappears. This tells me the TRRS portion is working fine.

I’ll try the test you suggested and get back to you.
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kgallen
Posts: 71
Joined: Sat May 07, 2022 5:44 pm
Location: Gloucestershire, UK

Re: How to route Monitor Send?

Post by kgallen »

Hi Thomas

One comment on your screen shots, I would set your MON1 and FX1 master faders to 0dB (at least for now) and use the channel faders for mixing.

In your screen shots the total mix would be very low as you have both the channel and master faders pretty low down. We would usually aim to get the ‘gain staging’ set up with the master around 0dB and being able to use the channel fader around -15 to +3 or so. To achieve this, adjust the gain on each channel screen (these are ‘turn knobs’) to get a good level from your mic - not too hot or too cold (as it’s known ‘in the business’).

Kevin
hionhifi
Posts: 6
Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2022 1:13 am

Re: How to route Monitor Send?

Post by hionhifi »

kgallen wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 7:37 am Hi Thomas

One comment on your screen shots, I would set your MON1 and FX1 master faders to 0dB (at least for now) and use the channel faders for mixing.

In your screen shots the total mix would be very low as you have both the channel and master faders pretty low down. We would usually aim to get the ‘gain staging’ set up with the master around 0dB and being able to use the channel fader around -15 to +3 or so. To achieve this, adjust the gain on each channel screen (these are ‘turn knobs’) to get a good level from your mic - not too hot or too cold (as it’s known ‘in the business’).

Kevin
I didn't get to check the details last night. I'll try to get to them tonight. In the meantime, I did adjust the master faders to 0db. I still can't hear any processing on my voice. I'll check the other things you recommended the day before yesterday.
hionhifi
Posts: 6
Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2022 1:13 am

Re: How to route Monitor Send?

Post by hionhifi »

kgallen wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 7:37 amI would set your MON1 and FX1 master faders to 0dB (at least for now) and use the channel faders for mixing.
SUCCESS AT LAST. :lol:

I did what you suggested...I was eventually able to dial in the perfect mix of wet FX1/dry MON1. Giving myself about 30% COMP on the Dyn.Mic ch and raising the gain to 55db to get good levels into my camera. The camera gain set to 0 so it's preamp isn't working hard.

I end up with the following settings.

Ch 3 - Dyn.Mic - 55db Gain, 30% COMP8, 80Hz Low Cut
FX1 - -45db, Master fader @ 0db
MON1 - -10db, Master fader @ 0db
MAIN - Off or the lowest level (when recording so as not to cause feedback.)

I piped the audio out of the camera via the headphone out (via a mic/heaphone splitter) into the FLOW 8 7/8 (L/R) channels so that I could hear back the audio when I played back the video. :lol:

Finally I saved the configuration in a snapshot. I haven''t figured out the mixer snapshot usefulness yet. Or how to use it.

Thank you for your help kgallen.
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kgallen
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Joined: Sat May 07, 2022 5:44 pm
Location: Gloucestershire, UK

Re: How to route Monitor Send?

Post by kgallen »

hionhifi wrote: Sat Jun 04, 2022 4:22 pm SUCCESS AT LAST. :lol:

I did what you suggested...I was eventually able to dial in the perfect mix of wet FX1/dry MON1. Giving myself about 30% COMP on the Dyn.Mic ch and raising the gain to 55db to get good levels into my camera. The camera gain set to 0 so it's preamp isn't working hard.
Great news! Looks like your mic is needing a lot of preamp gain. Is the noise level ok? What mic is this - is it a balanced connection from the mic to mixer? (i.e. XLR at both mic and mixer end, not TS jack).

Just be careful with that camera headphone feed into the mixer - just the slightest above-infinity on the fader and you'll have a horrible audio loop. I'd suggest only plugging that in after you've done your recording session, just to be sure!

But overall, a result. Enjoy!
hionhifi wrote: Sat Jun 04, 2022 4:22 pm Finally I saved the configuration in a snapshot. I haven''t figured out the mixer snapshot usefulness yet. Or how to use it.
You're one step ahead of me there. I've not played with the Flow8 library or snapshots yet...
ruka matthews
Posts: 1
Joined: Sat May 27, 2023 10:51 pm

Re: How to route Monitor Send?

Post by ruka matthews »

hello new to flow 8 is it possible to connect a fold back to the flow 8 mixer for live gigs
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