Fiber Fun

Everything to do with the Dante Audio Networking aspect of the digital eco-system
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GaryH
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Fiber Fun

Post by GaryH »

Anyone else out there using fiber optic cable with their Dante systems? I am a newbie for sure but gung-ho into it. it's how I spend a lot of my spare time these days :-) I now have the switches with SFP slots, the proper modules and cable (all much cheaper than I ever thought). All connected up and working nicely. It simply amazes me that it can be! Potentially 512 bidirectional ch's of crystal clear audio traveling at 2/3 the speed of light, for unreal long distance. Amazing tech. My system is of course much smaller, but as is, it's more than I will probably ever need in most situations. Anyway, enjoying the ride. Love to hear about others also doing this.
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MJKlein
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Re: Fiber Fun

Post by MJKlein »

@GaryH please elaborate. I'm using Dante for the short run between my console and PC, but I'm interested to know about the optical hardware.
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GaryH
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Re: Fiber Fun

Post by GaryH »

@MJKlein

It isn't all that hard really. It can get that way quickly though if you start using several Vlans or get deeper into management of large networks. I don't need that now, and maybe I never will. The deal hinges mostly on having switches with miniGBIC (SFP) slots so they can transfer your usual rj45 Dante network connections as an uplink (via fiber optic cable) to somewhere else. Like from your control booth to a switch with devices in the studio, FOH to stage, or your living room to wherever. There you would have another switch with at least one SFP module installed to send and recieve that part of the network via fiber. I now have 3 older Cisco (managed) switches. I bought them all well used and they ranged from $60-85 in cost each, so under $250 for all. The latest one has 48 ports with POE! One is a 24 port Gigabit switch and one is a 10 port version, also POE enabled. None of them possess the absolute latest tech and thus the cheap prices but all of them are MORE than adequate for a Dante audio network. The SFP modules new were $12 each, I just found 4 more used on ebay for $3 each, so all in about $60 for 8 modules (I only need 3 at the moment). The cable is LC/LC 9/125 Singlemode Duplex, it's all that's needed here and is also pretty much the most affordable option as it turns out. I just found (and ordered) 10 (yes 10) 40M rolls of Owens Corning cable for $34 total! Besides my Wing (with 2 64 ch dante cards installed at the moment) and a 32 ch X-Dante card, I have 3 Avio Dante stereo devices, a Switchcraft 4 output device and an Arista 2inx2out device. Those all require POE to run (or else you need those cumbersome wall warts) Both my larger switches each have 4 gigabit SFP slots, each of those slots can send fiber to a different location and switch if need be. The 10 port unit has 2 SFP slots. 4 slots each is way overkill for me at this point but it's nice to have options and it is what the switches came with. It's all just plug it in and use it as you know. I connected the X32 and my PC via rj45 in the usual way to switch 1, fiber from it to switch #2 which has the 5 POE devices plugged in via rj45. Fiber from switch #2 to the Wing via switch #3 a few rooms away. Interconnected like that, it becomes one large network. A computer that has either DVS or Dante Via installed becomes another dante device at whatever ch count you set DVS to be. I use the 64x64 DVS setting for my computers. You can connect any one ch (or many ch's) to anywhere else in that system. Mac to PC, PC to Mac, mac to Wing etc etc etc. I had my Mac connected and recording using Reaper (which I barely know yet), my PC recording with Sonar (what I know very well) and all are visible and reachable to one another using Dante Controller. I have not even closely settled on a definitive setup just yet, still just playing with it all and learning and seeing how crazy it can get as I go. For me designing it so it CAN be mobile is important. I eventually want to get a Dante enabled stagebox or 2 but right now they as scarce as hen teeth, not to mention expensive. They are probably still on a boat over your way :-) I do have more than my fair share of aes50 boxes which of course still work great and are accessible via the connected mixers anyway.
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MJKlein
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Re: Fiber Fun

Post by MJKlein »

Thanks for that detailed description @GaryH. That's really cool stuff!
湖口鄉新竹縣台灣 Hukou Township, Hsinchu County, Taiwan
Behringer X32/Dante + Soundcraft Ghost + X32ReaperAutoMate
English/中文
This site is hosted at Dathorn: https://dathorn.com/index.php?r=489
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pmaillot
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Re: Fiber Fun

Post by pmaillot »

@GaryH Wooow!
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GaryH
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Re: Fiber Fun

Post by GaryH »

A little cable update. I received my fiber optic delivery this week. I went as far as interconnecting/testing 7 of the rolls before I became a true believer and gave up. 280M (918 ft) hooked together without a hiccup in between the Wing switch and the X32/everything else switch. I have no doubts the rest of the rolls will function just fine as well. Much longer distances can be achieved if I ever have the need. I don't imagine even using all of what I have now but who knows. The "deal" was for 10 rolls at an extremely great price so that's what I bought. The vendor even threw in an extra 40m roll for free! I also had 2 50M rolls previously. This deal turned out to be about 3 cents per foot (yes 3 pennies) all said and done! Immune to EMI, ESD and RFI and all the usual copper adversaries. Lightweight, very strong. Hard to beat. I am not super fond of the color, but all single mode duplex fiber is the same color afaik, a very bright (hard to miss) yellow...oh well i'll learn to cope. People who may do something similar to this in a permanent install will never see it anyway after it's in place, or at least see very little of it. I continue to work at my setup and try to learn as much as I can along the way. Lots yet to do and learn. FAR from expert land. I think having a full redundant setup would seal the "take me anywhere, headache free, with full confidence" deal. I need one additional switch to try all that out which is on the radar. If nothing else, I'm having fun doing it.
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MJKlein
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Re: Fiber Fun

Post by MJKlein »

Wow @GaryH for reliability sake alone it seems worth it for permanent installations. Impervious to EMI/RFI.
湖口鄉新竹縣台灣 Hukou Township, Hsinchu County, Taiwan
Behringer X32/Dante + Soundcraft Ghost + X32ReaperAutoMate
English/中文
This site is hosted at Dathorn: https://dathorn.com/index.php?r=489
https://www.youtube.com/@phoenixmediaforge
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GaryH
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Re: Fiber Fun

Post by GaryH »

@MJKlein Yup, it's light over glass fibers, a different world. That said it needs Dante or some Aoip version to be of use for our music needs. If you have a Dante system, it's worth considering, I think. Because its unaffected by those things, it can run happily right next to power and analog audio lines, same conduit, etc. At least that has been touted as one big plus in deploying it.
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MJKlein
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Re: Fiber Fun

Post by MJKlein »

GaryH wrote: Mon Feb 21, 2022 6:33 pm If you have a Dante system, it's worth considering, I think.
I do indeed have a Dante system. I have a very short run in my studio. I'm interested in the technology and would consider that in the future for expansion.
湖口鄉新竹縣台灣 Hukou Township, Hsinchu County, Taiwan
Behringer X32/Dante + Soundcraft Ghost + X32ReaperAutoMate
English/中文
This site is hosted at Dathorn: https://dathorn.com/index.php?r=489
https://www.youtube.com/@phoenixmediaforge
curtbl
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Re: Fiber Fun

Post by curtbl »

@GaryH Well haven't been here for quite awhile..... way to busy in retirement..... Should have just gone fishing or golfing.
Oh well, Gary, glad you found fiber, it is indeed a very cool transport. Have been using it around the church between old and new buildings. So didn't even think about it as something beyond a transport..... Wait til you spend some time in Dante Domain Controller and multiple buildings or locations you will really be blown away. It is cool stuff! I'm impressed with the video additions to Dante, that is a game changer in my book. Syncing video and audio on the same network is great.
Hope you guys are all well!
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